Q9h Memory?

Discussion in 'Moto Q 9h' started by adamb78, Aug 29, 2007.

  1. adamb78

    adamb78 New Member

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    I see it this way: if I buy a computer with a 160 gig hard drive and 2 gigs of RAM, I expect to see 160 Total Space on the hard drive and 2 gigs Total RAM (minus of course the calculation rounding).

    If you ordered a computer with 2 gigs of RAM, then when to the Control Panel / System and it said only 1 gig of RAM total, you would probably be pretty annoyed.

    That is the situation here. The original Q was a POS IMHO because it didn't have enough RAM. No one really closes apps on WM...who has the time? And is it too much to ask to run ActiveSync, the calendar, contacts, and the Phone without the phone freaking out? So I was impressed to see that the Q9h had 96 megs of RAM...but then in comparing the numbers, it only had about 10 more megs "total" RAM than the original Q. Even though it had 32 more total megs.

    So anyway I think Motorola should just note this when they mention the RAM figures.
  2. Pony99CA

    Pony99CA Active Member

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    Memory Space

    You'll be disappointed with the hard disk, then. Hard drive vendors use 1 billion byte gigabytes, while Windows uses 1024 * 1024 * 1024 byte gigabytes. Hard drive vendors now specifically state things like "One GB means one billion bytes" to avoid confusion (I think they got sued about that).

    Also, those are unformatted capacities. Formatting a drive uses space.

    I have 768 MB in my laptop. BIOS only counts up to 704 (or something). My Computer System properties also only shows 704 MB. Do I freak out about that? No.

    Please. Read the forums and see how many people have the time to run Task Manager and close all running programs.

    However, I don't do that and have no problems running the programs that I want. Maybe they get closed in the background (the system is designed to do that if it needs memory), but I don't notice it.

    As I've said a few times now, if they don't state the "user-accessible" RAM space, I agree with you that they should. Show me an official Motorola spec sheet, product information or box where they mention 96 MB RAM but don't mention the user-accessible amount.

    Here are two Q9h links I've found at the Motorola U.K. site:Neither of those mention the ROM or RAM capacity (unless I missed it). They mention allowing up to 2 GB with a MicroSD card, though.

    I find it odd that they don't mention the memory sizes, but you can't claim to be misled if they never say anything. :wink:

    Steve
  3. adamb78

    adamb78 New Member

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    1. I knew someone would bring up the HD example. But we're talking small percentages there (a few percent), not 64 megs of RAM vs 96 (30% less). If I found out my 100 gig hard drive was only 70 gigs total (instead of 93 gigs, which it is), I would have a problem with it.

    2. As for your RAM, it probably shows 704 because you have onboard video...which if you look at your product spec sheet it probably says (memory shared between RAM and video). Either that or you have your BIOS set up to shadow or something. Yeah there is a gig counting issue, but for example my 2 gigs shows up as 2038 in Vista instead of 2048, which isn't that far off.

    In any case, the issue here is not a bytes vs. gigabytes issue. For the RAM, it's more like your video card being onboard and sharing RAM but them not mentioning it in the specs. For the storage space, that really doesn't have a good explanation I can see.

    I'm really not that pissed, I'm just raising the issue so people buying it know that unlike the original Q's numbers (which varied slightly from specs), the actual "total" RAM for the Q9h is 30% less than the specs, and the "total" storage space is about 40% less than the specs...and also trying to see if anyone has an explanation.
  4. adamb78

    adamb78 New Member

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    http://direct.motorola.com/ENG/q-specifications.asp?Country=GBR&language=ENG&productid=30722

    ... look in the "Data Features" area.

    They mention that it might vary depending on the phone carrier; but that is due to AT&T loading up all their crap or whatever. I have an unlocked phone that isn't carrier specific---so this "mention" shouldn't apply.
  5. ppcmd

    ppcmd New Member

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    I will say until the Q9h hits the US and is actually being sold we really can't say what the final memory configuration is or if the EU vs US spec is different in the memory area. If the spec says 96MB of RAM which is 32MB more than the Q9m, so one would expect and rightly so that it should have MORE useable RAM.

    I have noticed more that it has become a trend (albeit small one) for Mfg to hide (via omission) the memory config or simply put try to hide it from being an obvious issue. Users are way to smart and zero in on this as a weakness, something the mfg's need to pay attention to.
  6. ppcmd

    ppcmd New Member

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    One final thought for this evening (for me at least). I looked back at this thread and found the post with the (3) reviews presnted in it on the Q9h.

    One area that each review didn't drill into or expose well enough (for my satisfaction) was the memory configuration or how it would help or hinder the device. Pocketnow said "The extra RAM and ROM are very welcome additions as is the fast processor" but they don't mention what the memory config was or a screen shot of the memory breakdown. Smartoffice's review mentions ". . . 256MB of on-board flash memory, with 128MB of user memory . . . " but nothing on the application RAM which is rather important and Reg hard didn't have any real mention at all.

    So if memory isn't a big deal why are we worried? Good night all.
  7. adamb78

    adamb78 New Member

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    Here is an interesting thread on mobile devices and memory:
    http://blogs.msdn.com/windowsmobile/archive/2005/08/19/453784.aspx

    Specifically (from one of the comments)
    "...in general terms, there are a number RAM uses that aren't reported in the Memory CPL.

    For instance, an OEM might set aside a fair amount of RAM to allow the camera to write directly into it without using the CPU (a DMA buffer). Typically the way they do that is to tell the system there is less than the available RAM and then use the RAM the system doesn't know about.

    Another example is something called the "page pool." This is similar to the "page file" on a desktop system, and is heavilly used on NAND systems. The page pool isn't something a user can configure, so there's not much point in showing it in the Memory CPL.

    Devices with a cellular radios sometimes load the code for that radio (the "radio stack") into RAM outside of the OS.

    Code that can't be shut down or paged out, especially drivers, isn't shown on that Memory CPL either. There's no reason to show you the RAM the display driver is using, because you can't do anything about it.

    The frame buffer (see http://blogs.msdn.com/windowsmobile/archive/2005/09/07/462187.aspx) isn't counted in the Memory CPL either.

    Etc.

    The trouble is, all of this varies greatly from device to device. One device might allocate 100K for a camera buffer, while another might allocate 3M. That's a tradeoff between video camera capture framerate and ram usage. A NAND device might have a 6M page pool, while a NOR device doesn't need one at all. One device might have a 4M radio stack loaded into RAM while another might have a separate radio module that has its own RAM and doesn't need any system RAM to operate. A simple display driver might need 50K of code, while one capable of doing heavy 3D work might need 300K. A 240x320, 16 bit screen has a 150K frame buffer, while a 640x480 32 bit screen requires 1.2M.

    Despite assertations to the contrary from the comment above yours, there are devices that run comfortably in 32M. And there are devices that need 64 to be even reasonable. It's all about OEM tradeoffs between performance, ability, RAM usage, and cost. The OEMs weigh all these factors when deciding how much RAM to put into a device. "

    So it could be that Motorola allocated more RAM to the camera or display to speed up those aspects of the system? I wonder if there is a tool for "seeing" this other RAM (not like we could do anything about it). But it would make me feel better if I knew my camera would be faster than the Q and that's where the memory is going.

    Supposedly the more RAM you have the poorer the battery life will be...so it should be useful for something!
  8. Pony99CA

    Pony99CA Active Member

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    Memory Space & Unlocked Phones

    It was a good issue to raise. Unfortunately, it seems we're all mystified as to where the memory went.

    I'd probably look in the \Windows folder for other programs (like Office Mobile) that might be hogging ROM even though they aren't exposed. (The Q 9m supposedly doesn't have Office Mobile, but maybe the Q 9h does.)

    Of course, that will only help isolate where the ROM has gone. It won't help with your RAM issue.

    Steve
  9. Semseddin

    Semseddin New Member

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    Hello, it's my 1st post here and i have to bump this thread !

    So, why dont anybody accept the fact that motorola lied to its customers ? I am really pissed of to see that my q9h euro version has just 66mb ram and 125mb total rom. And i can't believe those little lies that the os is taking up so much space. How the hell can a Mpx200 run wm 6.5 then ?
  10. Tranzystor82

    Tranzystor82 Member

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    hello

    different between at&t and euro version is only "daughter board" - radio, gps . Everything else is the same. ( mother board ) Moto Q9 has 256 rom and 96ram but page pool and radio eat memory ;(
    ps page pool in WM 6.1 = 12MB

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